Server & Linux Question

[laughingbuddha]

Hi all,

Quick question on the Linux front. I'm considering replacing my current server with a newer, more powerful machine. Current box is a dual Xeon, but the processors are 32bit, so limited on memory and performance.

Question is this. Can I drive clone the old servers drives on to the new server? Not sure if it does work with Linux, but would save a MASSIVE amount of messing around, especially with the name servers I run, and the clients on the box.

Thanks all,

Matt

[scott]

Not with that big of a change, you'd be better off doing a parallel migration (ie, no down time).

[laughingbuddha]

Dam. That'll mean a new hosting contract, IP's, Namerserver changes and god know what else.

Grrrr.

It'll have to wait, especially at £1200 a year to co-locate per server. Thanks anyway.

[prupert]

Dam. That'll mean a new hosting contract, IP's, Namerserver changes and god know what else.

It shouldn't be that big a project, unless you have applied severe customizations on your current machine. We handle migrations like these all the time.

Why are you afraid of making IP address and thus DNS changes? It shouldn't be more that lowering the TTL and properly timing the A-record changes and voila. In case you are also using your Plesk server as an authoritative nameserver there is slightly more work involved, but if you transfer the DNS zones over to the new machine as well it only requires you to make two or three additional A-record changes, update your slave nameserver settings, and (if applicable) update the glue records at your registry.

[faris]

Or:
1) Setup new server
2) Migrate data to new server (almost foolproof)
3) Test (easy with Plesk 10 and 11's domain preview)
4) Shut down old server
5) Renumber IPs (easy these days) to old IPs.
6) Done

While you are thinking about this, why not look into Parallels Cloud Server 6 (or Virtuozzo 4.7). This could save you a lot of hassle in the future. Or Vmware/Xen/KVM/OpenVZ etc.

[laughingbuddha]

How my setup currently works is I have 33 domains hosted on a single server running Plesk 8.6.

I don't use virtuozzo (VPS) on this box as it is a 32bit server (processors don't support 64bit), so memory is limited being a 32bit OS, and as I currently have a single 100 Mbps LAN connection and 1 TB of data transfer per month, I didn't think virtuozzo was worth the cost and hassle.

I also run both nameservers on the same machine, using the batch of IPs I was issued by the server house. I know running both nameservers on the same machine introduces a point of failure, but at £1200 per year to host a box, I'm not likely to be able to host two until business improves.

Some domains on the server do have customisation, such a wildcard DNS which invovles changing the vhost as well as dns, so I'm not sure if that would migrate properly.

My consideration for the change is that the current server was installed in late 2008. It was a refurb when I got it, but I did upgrade the memory and HDDs for new ones, and it has had 1 HDD change since then due to failure. I also would like to move from Plesk 8.6 to the latest release, as 8.6 is at end-of-life anyway.

[prupert]

I didn't think virtuozzo was worth the cost and hassle.

In my experience Virtuozzo is a pain and I would certainly not recommend it. Others may have different experiences.

I also run both nameservers on the same machine, using the batch of IPs I was issued by the server house. I know running both nameservers on the same machine introduces a point of failure, but at £1200 per year to host a box, I'm not likely to be able to host two until business improves.

You don't need a large system to host a secondary nameserver. A small VPS may suffice, or you opt for a hosted secondary nameserver service.

Some domains on the server do have customisation, such a wildcard DNS which invovles changing the vhost as well as dns, so I'm not sure if that would migrate properly.

If the customizations are done outside of Plesk I recommend figuring out how to implement these within the supported scope of a newer Plesk version, perhaps before migrating to a new server to minimize the risks involved in the migration.

My consideration for the change is that the current server was installed in late 2008. It was a refurb when I got it, but I did upgrade the memory and HDDs for new ones, and it has had 1 HDD change since then due to failure. I also would like to move from Plesk 8.6 to the latest release, as 8.6 is at end-of-life anyway.

Plesk 8 is end-of-life already for some months now, see http://www.parallels.com/plesk/lifecycle/. I strongly recommend upgrading to a supported version to mitigate the security risks involved.

[laughingbuddha]

I did consider the option of setting up a Plesk instance on AWS, but as I understand it you can't setup/run nameservers on AWS Plesk instances.

[prupert]

I did consider the option of setting up a Plesk instance on AWS, but as I understand it you can setup/run nameservers on AWS Plesk instances.

AWS (EC2) is just Amazon's flavor of a Xen VPS. It should allow you to run a nameserver if you want (I am guessing you wanted to say cannot in stead of can). There are of course other providers that offer a comparable service.

Please note that you do not need Plesk to run a secondary nameserver, if that is what you were talking about. We have good experience with PowerDNS. For our clients we have set up several PowerDNS slave nameservers for Plesk master nameservers, which works perfectly.

[laughingbuddha]

I had considered setting up an EC2 Plesk instance, migrating users to that, then replacing the server and migrating users back. But I'm not completely clear on if migration from Plesk 8.6 to 11 (or what ever is the latest flavour) is indeed possible, that and how/if I could migrate the ns1 nameserver too, to prevent user down time.

The down time is the key, as I do have a few domains/services that need to be up, such as an SMS service and 2 radio station websites.

On and yes, it should have been can't instead of can.

[prupert]

I had considered setting up an EC2 Plesk instance, migrating users to that, then replacing the server and migrating users back. But I'm not completely clear on if migration from Plesk 8.6 to 11 (or what ever is the latest flavour) is indeed possible, that

Read the documentation to find out if the Plesk Migration Manager on version 11 supports migrations from version 8.6.

As noted earlier though I would recommend first finding out if your current setup is at all "upgradeable" to version 11 before doing the migration. This way you severely minimize the number of possible failures during the migration.

Why would you want to migrate twice via a temporary VPS in stead of just once to the new server right away? Doing the migration twice involves more costs, more points of failure and more impact on your customers.

and how/if I could migrate the ns1 nameserver too, to prevent user down time.

That is easy. You just keep the old nameserver on for some time after you have migrated websites and changed website A-records (on both the new and the old server) and if everything is alright, update the SOA records on the new nameserver, point the two nsX.<domain> A-records to the new IP address, and update the glue at your registrar.

Note that you can migrate without noticeable downtime, but be wary of the split brain problem.

[laughingbuddha]

Upgrading Plesk 8.6 to 11 on a production server....are you crazy

[prupert]

Upgrading Plesk 8.6 to 11 on a production server....are you crazy

It's certainly adventurous, but if you've done it a dozen times and prepare well it's manageable. But I guess it's not a bad idea to first try out the migration to simulate an upgrade to Plesk 11.

Running an EOL control panel on a production system might be considered more crazy!

[scott]

My 2 cents on AWS, their flavor of xen is inconsistent so you may find blocking errors with certain functions plesk is going to require. Nginx for example relies on eventfd(), which sometimes isnt available in AWS so it would fail with a hard error.

My experiences with AWS have all been bad, I do not recommend it for any kind of hosting.

[biggles]

I'm kind of in the same situation, but is really thinking about moving away from Plesk. CPanel seems much more reliable right now. And they have a migration service included in their offer...

Now if they just could get that RPM-thingy running and get the go sign from Scott and Mike...

BTW, I'm running my secondary DNS at cloudns.net since about a year. Works great and costs about $20 per year for unlimited entries...